Interview with Charles - North Korean Student at Coding Dojo
Charles escaped from North Korea and made the dangerous journey to safety without the help of a rescue. He resettled to the US in 2012, completing high school and soon after taking the opportunity to participate in a rigorous coding bootcamp through a partner of Liberty in North Korea, Coding Dojo. Charles is now attending community college and pursuing his own coding project. We had a chance to meet with Charles this summer to learn more about his life in North Korea and his new coding passion. Read the interview is below. Charles is also fundraising for rescues with us!
LiNK: Why did you choose to resettle to the US?
Charles: I was born between a North Korean mom and a Chinese dad, which put me in a difficult situation. I wasn’t accepted into South Korea because my Dad is Chinese, even though I had proof of having been captured once in China for being a North Korean refugee. So I applied for refugee status through the United Nations and resettled in the US.
LiNK: You attended Coding Dojo’s coding Bootcamp earlier this year - so cool! Between coding language, English, and borrowed words in Korean, which was the hardest language to learn?
Charles: Coding was hard. You have to know the terms while learning the specific coding language, so that was a challenge. I’m still teaching myself the parts of coding that I find difficult. As for borrowed words in Korean, I didn’t know those existed at all until I started to talk to more Koreans in the US. Borrowed words frequently came up, and I would have to ask people around me to explain the words that I couldn’t understand; part of the challenge was how the same word is pronounced differently in Korean and in English. Shortened words in Korean were tough to learn as well.
LiNK: What’s your favorite thing about programming?
Charles: My favorite thing about programming is I have finally discovered what I truly want to do with my life. I used to want to be a doctor one day, a cop the next day, and maybe a week later, I would want to join the army. Coding first became my hobby and thanks to Coding Dojo, it became something I want to make a career out of. It’s a lot of fun. But aside from that, I’ve also met good friends and instructors at Coding Dojo. I think it’s safe to say coding made me pull a 180 in life. I’m set on computers for now.
LiNK: Can you tell us about a project you’ve been working on?
Charles: Sure. I’ve been working on a project using MEAN stack to make an auction platform for ideas. Users can present ideas, sell ideas, buy ideas… You could say that it’s similar to Ebay in a way, but I think at this stage it’s important to emulate what other people have made to explore and learn about various successful models rather than trying to create something entirely new and different. With the current version, users can upload an idea onto the platform, but there’s been glitches in the idea being transferred to the the auction page. So that’s something I’ve been struggling with, but I think I’m going to finish it pretty soon.
LiNK: How do you get into computer programming as a career in North Korea?
Charles: I’m not sure because I don’t have any friends who went to university, although I do have a relative who was able to go. Most students who go to university come from wealthy families or are people who have been able to make a good amount of money from market activities, and they might find that kind of job. But in North Korea a lot of occupations are passed down from your parents, for example if you’re a politician then your children will also likely become politicians.
LiNK: After coding, what do you like to do in your free time?
Charles: I’m usually at the gym working out. If it’s breezy and not too hot outside, I go to the park and listen to music. You can find me sitting on a bench with my headphones on.
LiNK: What kinds of things do you think about when you’re at a park listening to your music?
Charles: Usually I think about memories from North Korea. When I’m busy my mind is preoccupied with work, but when I have more time on my hands I often think back on my life in North Korea -- both the good days and the hungry days.
LiNK: Can you share one of your favorite memories with us?
Charles: Sure. I had a lot of friends back in North Korea, and we were always outdoors in nature. I lived near Daedong River, so every Sunday, five to six friends of mine and I would have cookouts near the river. We would get rice, a pot, and some firewood to make porridge. Would I do that here? Probably not. I could try, but I think being with my friends was what made it memorable and special. Even when we were hungry, we were hungry together.
LiNK: That sounds really nice. Have you found any foods that you like to eat here?
Charles: Subway! I love sandwiches. My go-to Korean food is Kimchijiggae. I also like Vietnamese noodles — Pho.
LiNK: Cool. What are three things you want to accomplish by the end of this year?
Charles: First is completing my programming project, the Idea Auction project that I mentioned earlier. Second is getting accepted into the community college that I’m applying to. And third would be keeping in good health!
LiNK: Those are some solid goals. You drive Uber sometimes, right? When you’re talking with riders, do you share that you’re from North Korea?
Charles: Well, not a lot of people in the US are aware about North Korea. They say, “Where are you from?” So I would say, “I’m from North Korea,” and they go, “How is it there?” Haha. So I tell them that North Korea is the counterpart of South Korea. The funny thing is that they might not be familiar with North Korea, but they know what I’m talking about when I say the name Kim Jong Un. Then, they don’t believe me and say it’s impossible to escape. When I share my story, they’re very surprised. A lot of my customers stick around to listen to my story even after we’ve arrived at the destination. Even if it’s late at night, people don’t get out of my car until I finish my story.
One Day with the North Korean People | LiNK Summit 2023
After five years, LiNK Summit made its return on June 3rd, 2023! Over 200 Allies, North Korean advocates, fellow activists, and global LiNK staff gathered to spend One Day with the North Korean People in Long Beach, CA. We had supporters who drove hundreds of miles and flew in from across the US, bringing friends and family to join the movement.
Working on this issue can often feel isolating. Summit was a much-needed, powerful reminder that so many incredible people are committed to seeing a free North Korea in our lifetime. Through the course of a day, attendees had the opportunity to hear directly from and collaborate with North Koreans through different breakout sessions and experiences.
The Jangmadang Experience
Perhaps the highlight of this year’s Summit was The Jangmadang Experience – a collection of interactive booths and installations inspired by North Korea’s grassroots markets. Attendees could see smuggled goods, try North Korean food, pick up swag, and find ways to take action.
The “Taste of North Korea” food booth was a favorite among guests. Our North Korea-born staff were able to source authentic North Korean cookies and candy, as well as corn flour, which they used to prepare sweet corn rice cakes at the event.
People returned for seconds, then thirds. Our North Korean friends were shocked by the familiar tastes, and reminisced about the last time they had these snacks in North Korea. It was so heartwarming to see how food connected past and present, and created a new experience for everyone.
“Under the Same Sky” was a collaborative installation inspired by Joseph Kim’s memoir and the colorful prayer ribbons at Imjingak Park near the border of North & South Korea. When Joseph Kim thinks about his sister, whom he hasn’t seen since his escape, he says:
“Right now, we only share the stars. But I can look up at night and see that you are under the same sky. That will have to be enough until I find you.”
Attendees were asked to share their own messages of hope and tie them to the wall. As the day passed, it was so encouraging to see the number of ribbons grow- a reminder that we’re all under the same sky, and one day every North Korean will be free.
Another popular destination was “Past Lives,” a collection of smuggled goods and mementos from North Korea. Each of the objects- North Korean money, propaganda posters and pins, a razor blade, a floral dress, and more- held powerful stories and memories from the past lives of our North Korean friends.
As guests perused the rest of the booths, they could write postcards inviting people to become Allies, record a message of encouragement to our North Korean friends, marvel at photos from inside North Korea, and more. It was a vibrant and exciting part of the day, emulating the dynamism of the Jangmadangs in North Korea!
The Red Box Live
Inspired by our popular YouTube series, The Red Box, we created an offline opportunity to ask our North Korean friends anything about life in the most closed country in the world. Harry, Joy, and Sunghee shared their personal stories while candidly responding to audience questions about everything from dating in North Korea to experiences with discrimination in South Korea.
“I learned that every North Korean refugee has their own unique story, and the freedom they enjoy now is something that all 25 million North Koreans deserve.”
– Summit attendee
Imagining the Future of North Korea
We can’t know what path North Korea will take, but we do know that irreversible change is already happening and it's being driven by the people. In this panel we had North Korean activist, Seohyun Lee; expert on North Korea’s technology and media environment, Nat Kretchun; and LiNK’s South Korea Country Director, Sokeel Park, lead a discussion around imagining the future of North Korea and how we can support change.
Increasing the North Korean people’s access to outside information is one of our biggest opportunities to accelerate change on the ground. This session provided insight into the world’s most closed off country and LiNK’s current work in the area of information dissemination.
Allies Hackathon
The Allies Hackathon was a nod to the grassroots origins of LiNK, and how supporter-led LiNK Teams continue to be at the forefront of this movement. At this interactive session, participants teamed up to brainstorm how we can bring more attention to this issue, drawing from other parts of the day. The goal was to equip and empower attendees to take the momentum from Summit back to their communities!
“Jihyun and Esther brought the energy for the Allies Hackathon! I thought the prompts and how we broke into different groups was great, and it was fun to hear everyone’s ideas. I plan to stay in touch with my little group and hopefully we can encourage each other to stay active in our support for this issue.”
– Summit attendee
North Korean Agents of Change
North Korean defectors have incredible potential to impact this issue, from both inside the country and as they resettle in freedom. In this session, LiNK’s CEO, Hannah Song, led a conversation with North Korean advocate, Daehyeon Park, and a visionary North Korean entrepreneur who are supporting their communities, empowering others, and leading this movement as agents of change.
“Daehyeon was asked ‘What would it take for CHANGE - the big change in North Korea, that we all want to see.’ He was very quick to respond that LiNK currently has about 30 employees. What would it take for them to have 300 employees, 1000 employees? I was SO STRUCK at his faith in LiNK, that THIS ORGANIZATION could make this happen! He, who has been through it all, believes that this group of workers and volunteers are enough. They are passionate enough, smart and inventive and creative enough, to open up and free his nation. I was on a high all the way home!”
– Summit attendee
Keynote Speaker: Joseph Kim
After a day of nonstop inspiration and life-changing conversations, everyone gathered to hear from Joseph Kim, a North Korean defector, advocate, and the Associate & Expert-in-Residence, Freedom and Democracy at the Bush Center.
In 2013, Joseph delivered a TED Talk on the importance of hope and published a memoir, “Under the Same Sky.” At Summit, he revisited the power of choosing to have hope for this issue.
“It’s important to remember that North Korea is a land with darkness, not a land of darkness. There is hope for the future, and I have chosen to live my life believing in that hope.”
Finally, LiNK’s CEO, Hannah Song, wrapped up the day with a few parting words on what lies ahead.
“I know that North Korea can seem like this unchanging issue, one that definitely feels hopeless at times. In those brief moments of despair, I think about how hard some of our North Korean friends fought for their freedom…. I’m reminded that it is a privilege for us to do this work, because that means there is still something that we can do.”
At the end of the day, our excitement and confidence in the future was renewed. Each and every one of us has the ability to be a force for change. As the North Korean people strive towards their freedom, their hope for the future should galvanize us all.
We’re already looking forward to the next LiNK Summit! From all of us on the LiNK team - thank you to everyone who made this day one to remember.
