North Koreans Learning English | Interview with LELP Student & Volunteer
As North Korean refugees resettle in South Korea’s competitive society, conversational English ability has been identified as a top need for personal and professional growth.
The LiNK English Language program (LELP) has become a mainstay in our efforts to help build the capacity of North Koreans as agents of change. Students are matched 1:1 with volunteer tutors from all around the world, leading to customized practice, conversations that break down barriers, and connections that will last a lifetime. In addition to weekly virtual study sessions, the program includes in-person bonding activities and a semesterly speech contest.
Spring 2024 has been the program’s biggest semester yet with 156 participants, including 78 North Korean students and 78 volunteers! Meet Stella, a North Korean student pursuing her PhD in Economics, and Cydney, a long-time LELP volunteer from the United States.
Please briefly introduce yourselves and share how you first met!
Stella - Hi, I’m Stella from North Korea. I’m currently living in South Korea and working towards getting my PhD in Economics.
Cydney - I’m Cydney, I’m from the US. I’ve been in South Korea for four years, teaching English at a hagwon. I’ve been a volunteer with LELP for two years now.
Stella - I don’t exactly remember when we met, it’s been so long!
Cydney - I think it was at the LELP hiking event! That was our first time meeting in-person.
Stella - Right, I was a little nervous then.
Cydney - Now we meet up all the time, going out for drinks and finding new places to check out in Seoul.
What has been your favorite activity during the program?
Stella - I really enjoy the speech contest. I can share my story and everyone is so attentive - the other North Korean students, volunteers, and LiNK staff. At other places, they’ll give you fixed questions that you have to answer. But LiNK gives you complete control over what you want to talk about.
People say North Koreans come from a prison, and sadness is the primary emotion. But in my experience, there is happiness even in the small things. I love to talk about those stories, my childhood memories.
First I’ll write my speech in Korean, and then I’ll write it again in English with Cydney’s help. I say what I want to express and she’ll help me.
Cydney - Sometimes I’ll write five different sentences and explain the nuances to Stella, and then she’ll go ‘okay that one, that’s how I want to say it.’
Stella - The days leading up to the speech content, I have so many feelings and emotions while I’m busy preparing. But afterwards, I feel a sense of relief. I love it because by sharing my story, I’m realizing new things about myself.
Cydney - I’m usually crying when she finishes delivering her speech. I’m just so happy and proud of all her hard work, and she’s so good at it. Hearing the speeches of the other students is also always so inspiring.
Is there a moment or everyday interaction where you felt LELP helped you?
Stella - Yes, there is. This semester I’m taking a microeconomics seminar and the class goes into English all the time. The professor asks us questions, and we have to answer in English. If I wasn’t part of LELP, then I would have never thought about raising my hand and talking with confidence. Even if my grammar isn’t perfect, I can still comfortably share my thoughts.
What are your dreams or goals?
Stella - I have a big dream. I want to be a professor someday, at the undergraduate or graduate level. More than just teaching a certain topic or subject, I hope to instill in my students a love of learning. That’s what my teacher back in my hometown did for me. I’ve been able to come this far because of her, and she continues to inspire me to this day.
In North Korea, education opportunities are limited. But my teacher always tried to help me. She told us that if we had big dreams, then we can grab the chance to make it happen. She taught me a lot of things, about life and to see more than our current circumstances. I think about her all the time, even now, and I want to be like her - a good teacher and a good person.
I consider this my third chance at life. First I just survived in North Korea, and second in China. Now in South Korea, I can finally live freely.
Cydney - I love this story. Since I know Stella wants to be a professor, I also asked why, and she shared her memories from growing up in North Korea. Knowing that she’s wanted to do this for so long, it just makes sense.
As for my future goals, I don’t have anything concrete like teaching, but I want to help people. I want to use all the things I learn and that I’m interested in to help people find themselves. LELP has given me a great opportunity to meet new friends from different backgrounds and be a part of this meaningful cause as a volunteer.
Has being part of this program changed your perspective on North Korea?
Cydney - Yes, definitely. Before LiNK, I had read a lot of books and biographies from North Koreans. With that kind of exposure, you hear a lot of the hard stuff. Very inspirational stories about incredible people, but tough to read. I wanted to get a bigger picture of the issue, and that naturally led me to LiNK. After volunteering with LELP for two years, my perspective has not just changed, but really expanded.
I’ve had a lot of conversations with Stella where the contexts of what we’re talking about could not be more different, but our experiences are very much the same. It’s brought this universal view of people doing their best to live their lives, and connecting over it.
Stella - A lot of times, people want to hear hard stories from North Koreans. If you talk about your happiness, they ask ‘Why are you here then? You can go back there.’ It always surprises me - how can they say something like that? People living anywhere, have both happy times and difficult situations. But they don’t want to hear positive things from North Korea, they just want to hear that you were living in hell.
But LiNK is different. I feel like I can just talk comfortably. It has made me want to continue this program. Other places have a political focus but LiNK doesn’t, just real human stories.
Cydney - It’s one of my favorite things about how LiNK shares stories of North Koreans. They don’t shy away from the hardship, but they’re showing happy, thriving people and smiling faces. It’s not, ‘come to our page to learn about our sadness,’ but ‘learn about these real people whose experiences we want to share.’
Did LiNK’s program further your interest in sharing North Korean stories and experiences?
Stella - Actually we planned it, we talked about her drawing pictures and me writing the stories.
Cydney - It’s still very much in the talking phase, but it’s been my dream to make a webtoon! We’ve thought about creating one together about a little North Korean girl and sharing Stella’s experiences through this format.
My undergraduate degree was in history, so I spent a long time studying situations similar to what happens in North Korea. It’s hard for me to know that I live in a time where people go through such things, especially people close to me, like Stella. I think what LiNK does is so important because it’s trying to change the narrative and what the history of North Korea will be. If I can have any part of it, I want to do what I can.
What is something that each of you learned from each other?
Stella - Cyndey is just such a strong person. Before I met her, I thought I was strong, but we shared our stories and I’m so amazed by her determination. She’s alone here in South Korea, with a different language and culture, but she never complains. She always tries to make the best of life and find happiness.
Cydney - I lived in the States, then I lived in China, and then in Korea. So there have been a lot of cultural challenges. The longer I’m here, I realize, ‘Oh, the things that I’m culturally used to are so different here that it’s starting to weigh on me.’ In those times, it’s been so great to talk to Stella.
That’s something we relate closely on, actually, both having to learn to live in South Korea.
She’s become one of my closest friends and we spend 90% of our time together just laughing. She’s so ambitious. I watch her do everything she can to reach her goals, and I think to myself, ‘I can do that too.’
Stella - I’m still reflecting on my experiences, so sometimes I try to find therapy but it hasn’t really helped me. But talking with Cydney has. She listens without judgment, and feels with me. So it’s become not just studying English together, but I feel healed with her.
Thank you for making programs like the LiNK English Language program possible. Every day, we see the impact that opportunities like this have in the lives of our North Korean friends, and members of this global movement.
Help us ensure that the LELP can continue, improve, and expand in the years to come.
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NK Perspectives: 5 North Koreans weigh in on the second Kim-Trump Summit
We asked 5 North Koreans what they thought of the 2nd Kim-Trump summit, their perception of the U.S while growing up, and what they wish the world knew about North Korea.
What went through your mind when you saw Kim Jong Un and President Trump shaking hands last year?
Jessie Kim
27 years old, from Hyesan, escaped in 2011
Jessie: When I saw Trump and Kim Jong Un shaking hands during the first North Korea-U.S. summit, two things came into my mind.
1. With the help of the United States, maybe South and North Korea will actually reunify. And especially when I saw them shaking hands, I couldn’t stop crying thinking how one day I might meet my family again.
2. At the same time, I was worried that the world might forget about the North Korean people who are suffering behind Kim Jong Un’s political showmanship.
Jung Jin
35 years old, from Yanggang Province, escaped in 2014
Jung Jin: In North Korea, everyone is taught to be hostile towards America from an early age. We’re taught that the American imperialists are our mortal enemy with whom we cannot live together under the same sky.
So when I saw Kim Jong Un smiling and shaking hands with the president of the U.S., I really wondered what was going on in his head. For Trump, it’s about nuclear weapons, and for Kim Jong Un, it’s about maintaining his regime. I was worried about who on earth would help the tens of millions of North Korean people who are suffering because of that regime.
Geumhyok Kim
27 years old, from Pyongyang, escaped in 2012
Geumhyok: It didn’t leave me with any particular feeling. Watching the heads of the two countries, which have been enemies for so long, shaking hands and strolling down a garden path together can itself be an emotional and meaningful thing.
However, I feel that the Singapore Summit had far too many shortcomings to solve the nuclear problems of the Korean Peninsula when one considers the highly complex underlying issues and interests involved. In the final analysis, although it may have looked as if the North Korean issue might even be solved immediately after the summit, nothing has changed in reality and it has only served to highlight the difference in the basic positions of the two sides.
Joseph Park
37 years old, from North Hamkyung Province, escaped in 1999
Joseph: To be honest, I was expecting the Trump-Kim moment to be more emotional because the previous summit between president Moon and Kim Jong Un was such a powerful moment, but it didn’t live up to my expectation. Unlike the inter-Korean summit, the U.S-North Korea summit hasn’t produced any tangible results, which is disappointing.
Jinho Kim*
24 years old, from Chongjin, escaped in 2008
Jinho: I felt that many people would fall for the propaganda. Kim Jong Un shook hands with the president of the United States for the first time in history, so the thought that many people expected peace to come and might see Kim Jong Un as a normal leader worried me. The more Kim Jong Un develops his image as a normal leader, the quieter the voices calling for human rights for the North Korean people will become.
*Name changed for privacy reasons
When you were in North Korea, what was your perception of the United States?
Jessie: When I was growing up in North Korea, I really wanted to visit America during my lifetime. When I was young, my grandma used to tell me stories about American soldiers [that she met during the Korean War], and after my mother died I used a lot of American dollars while running my private business. The North Korean government teaches us that America is very bad, but in the jangmadang (markets) the U.S. dollar is valued very highly. These social contradictions made me doubt the state, and ultimately led to my escape.
Jung Jin: Since I received so much anti-American education when I was young, I thought that Americans were all scary looking vicious murderers. But my thinking started to change as I got older and I watched American movies that were smuggled across the border from China. I was able to feel at least a bit like Americans are just human and many of them are good people.
Geumhyok: When I was in North Korea, I received two kinds of education about the U.S. The first was the general anti-American education and the second was a more in-depth strategic analysis of the U.S. when I was enrolled at the Pyongyang Foreign Languages School and Kim Il Sung University as a student of English Literature. I personally felt the power of the U.S, and was afraid of it. I never once thought that North Korea could defeat the U.S. in a war as claimed by the North Korean government. In fact, I dreaded the opposite outcome.
Joseph: We were taught that the United States is our mortal enemy who made the Korean people suffer, and is an invader occupying South Korea. However, when I came to South Korea the people that influenced me the most were Americans. Despite the sanctions imposed on North Korea by the U.S. and the international community, the people doing humanitarian work in the North are Americans. I think the North Korean government demonizes the U.S. for political gain in much the same way American politicians demonize Islam or South Korean right-wing politicians and the Abe administration of Japan demonize North Korea for political gain.
Jinho: I was faithful to what I was taught so I believed the U.S. was our mortal enemy. When I played with my friends, the kids playing the role of ‘bad guys’ always pretended to be Americans. When the U.S. and North Korea made a gesture of peace, I thought that the U.S. was surrendering to North Korea. I only thought of the U.S. as an imperialist power that was oppressing our people.
What are your personal hopes for this summit?
Jessie: Honestly, I don’t have high hopes for the second North Korea-U.S. summit. After the first NK-U.S. summit that seemed would lead to huge change, and after three North-South summits, I think the world has just helped Kim Jong Un to get what he wants. Especially when we consider that the second NK-U.S. summit is being held in Hanoi, Vietnam, we can see more clearly what Kim Jong Un’s objective is. If we really want to achieve peace between North Korea and South Korea, then we need to throw away any hopes of North Korea giving up their nuclear weapons and direct our policy effort at making North Korea reform, open, and develop the economy for the people, not just for Kim Jong Un.
Jung Jin: I know it seems like a really futile hope, but I wish that the North Korean people are in Kim Jong Un’s mind even a little bit when he is doing this summit. I hope rather than only obsessing about how he can maintain his regime, he spares a second’s thought for the people."The one thing I want to tell the world about North Korea is that the people living there are ordinary people just like us."
Geumhyok: To be honest, I am skeptical about the upcoming meeting. A summit is no more than a show. I would say that the series of working-level talks leading up to the summit are more important. There have been many negotiations but denuclearization is becoming less likely by the day, and in fact it seems we might be heading for just a nuclear freeze. It’s hard to see a negotiation that deviates from one’s original goal and gradually finds a point of compromise as a victorious one. That’s why I don’t have high hopes for this summit.
Joseph: I hope North Korea and the U.S. end the armistice and declare an end to the war, sign a peace treaty, and establish diplomatic relations. And I sincerely hope that North Korea dismantles its nuclear weapons and the Korean peninsula turns into a land of peace so that there is no more pain for separated families.
Jinho: I hope the U.S. will take the initiative in the talks and force Kim Jong Un to give up his nuclear weapons and open up the country. I hope that there will be no declaration ending the Korean War or the signing of a peace agreement. Since North Korea still has the ambition of unifying the whole peninsula, if there is a declaration ending the war or peace treaty, the Korean Peninsula could fall into the hands of North Korea, just like what happened in Vietnam which is where Kim Jong Un chose as the venue for the talks.
If North Korea were to sign a peace treaty and improve relations with the United States, a country they have long propagandized as their eternal enemy, how would this influence North Korean society and culture?
Jessie: Personally, I think it’s difficult to expect that signing a peace treaty and ending hostilities will change the perceptions of ordinary citizens who are struggling to make a living, because a peace treaty signed by Kim Jong Un would be for the benefit of the regime, not for the people. A true peace treaty is one that facilitates economic reforms and actually improves the lives of the people.
Jung Jin: North Korean people live with not just their freedom, but even their human instincts repressed. If North Korea ends their hostile relationship with America, the symbol of capitalism, then socially and culturally the winds of capitalism will blow strongly in North Korea. I think there will be a lot of change in people’s fashion particularly. And if people’s fashion changes, then of course people’s consciousness changes too.
Geumhyok: A peace treaty between the U.S. and North Korea has many meanings. I, too, want to see the hostilities between the two countries end and an improvement of bilateral relations. However, to realize this there are many hurdles to be overcome. Realistically, it’s near impossible. First, the situation in South Korea doesn’t allow it. The two Koreas have starkly different systems and their respective constitutions both state that the other side should be reunified under their system. A peace treaty between the U.S. and North Korea will undermine the basis for the deployment of U.S. troops in South Korea and, in turn, destabilize the North-South power balance. This can catalyze new security concerns and affect the Northeast Asian order in an unpredictable way. Without any meaningful change to the authoritarian dictatorship of North Korea, the socio-cultural impact of a peace treaty will not be felt by the people. In fact, it can work towards bolstering North Korea’s dictatorship."...a peace treaty signed by Kim Jong Un would be for the benefit of the regime, not for the people. A true peace treaty is one that facilitates economic reforms and actually improves the lives of the people."
Joseph: People really dislike Japan, but no North Koreans dislike goods made in Japan. It’s the same with the U.S.: people hate the U.S. but there is no one that would say no to Hollywood movies or Apple products. Even Kim Jong Un uses an iMac and an iPad. After the North Korea-U.S. summit last year, the North Korean government has been promising its people a peaceful future with the U.S., ending the hostility between the two countries. I think a new future awaits the North Koreans. But I hope only good things will go into that pure and untouched land.
Jinho: To my knowledge, North Korea will advertise it as the U.S. surrendering to North Korea. Then North Koreans will once again gain hope for the regime and abandon their ideas about human rights. Just because a peace agreement is signed does not mean that Kim Jong Un will give freedom to his people. I think this will only change Kim Jong Un's political position and have no positive impact on the real human rights and lives of the North Korean people.
What do you wish people around the world who will be watching this summit knew about North Korea?
Jessie: As humans born on this earth we all have basic rights. But North Korean people live without even knowing the meaning of such a word. Media portrayals of Kim Jong Un, [his wife] Ri Sol Ju carrying an expensive handbag, and the parts of Pyongyang shown to the world are not the true North Korea. North Korean people are hidden behind the veils of skyscrapers and luxury handbags. The one thing I want to tell the world about North Korea is that the people living there are ordinary people just like us. I hope we don’t forget about the North Korean people who can’t even claim their right to life.\"The more Kim Jong Un develops his image as a normal leader through these summits, the more the international community will lose interest in the oppression and control he has on the people."
Jung Jin: It seems that people think Kim Jong Un represents North Korea, and I guess people around the world can think that. But I wish people knew the fact that behind Kim Jong Un, who is abnormally obese, even in his mid-30s, there are many North Korean children and adults who are skinny and have stunted growth because of food shortages. I can tell you for certain that North Koreans are generally shorter than South Koreans. We’re the same ethnicity and we have the same blood, so I can only conclude that this difference in our physiques must come from the differences in nutrition.
Geumhyok: The North Korea-U.S. summit is a show; a show of a grand scale. What’s important is the series of working-level negotiations happening below that. We need to closely watch what is being negotiated. These shows are dazzling, and when fireworks are too bright people cover their eyes and ears. But when the show finishes and darkness returns, everything will go back to the way it was before. The Singapore Summit was like that. We can’t let people have fantasies about Kim Jong Un’s dictatorship, because such fantasies only strengthen the power of the dictatorship.
Joseph: I hope people remember the 25 million North Koreans when they watch the summit between North Korea and the U.S. Those who’ve had to suffer the most due to the hostile relationship with North Korea are the North Korean people, not the regime. Peace will improve people’s lives. Peace will solve the issue of separated families. Peace will solve people’s hunger. Peace will solve the problems of people in pain. I think this is the most fundamental way of restoring people’s human rights."We can’t let people have fantasies about Kim Jong Un’s dictatorship, because such fantasies only strengthen the power of the dictatorship."
Jinho: Just because the leaders talk, it does not mean that the lives of North Koreans will change. Kim Jong Un is no different from his father Kim Jong Il and his grandfather Kim Il Sung in the sense that they are all dictators. He executed his relatives using anti-aircraft guns in order to maintain his regime, and cleared away homeless orphans and neglected them. North Koreans are still oppressed and are being sent to prison camps to be killed. The only reason the number of starving people is reducing is not because of Kim Jong Un, but because of the jangmadang (markets) developed by the North Korean people themselves. The more Kim Jong Un develops his image as a normal leader through these summits, the more the international community will lose interest in the oppression and control he has on the people. Citizens in the international community must be aware of this, and avoid only watching the political aspects shown through these summits.
